popcorn youth

David Bazan: Well, most of the songwriting process happened while Pedro the Lion was still intact. Usually I was just writing songs whenever it came, but after my good friend Tim quit, I decided not to use the band name anymore. I had most of these songs written, and I then set out to make it my first solo EP or release. Once I decided to make it a solo EP, I didn’t have to make a bunch of new songs.

Popcorn Youth: What distinguishes your solo projects from Pedro the Lion?

David Bazan: Well, I stopped using the name Pedro the Lion, because there was some fundamental problem with the way that the band worked that I couldn’t put my finger on. I felt like I needed to step back from doing that band in order to discover what it was that had gone wrong. And the meaning of the fundamental problem was that I couldn’t even make the band work with my best buddy — the guy who I most like to play music with that I know! So it was decision that came out of grief for both of us too, because that period was definitely very traumatic for the both of us, myself and Tim Walsh. Basically, the EP isn’t that far removed from Pedro the Lion records, really. It was a name change, and in support of that EP, I am playing alone, instead of playing in a band, which I always did as Pedro the Lion.

Popcorn Youth: Does your current repetoire still include old Pedro the Lion songs?

David Bazan: Yes, it does. I play 20 songs usually, and I really only have, like, five that are David Bazan songs.

Popcorn Youth: Do you have a full length release planned?

David Bazan: Well, at that point in time the record label Jade Tree, which released Pedro the Lion records, were changing distribution. So they didn’t have a distributer yet, and they were switching over to Touch & Go, but something was not yet in place. But we wanted to get an EP out relatively quickly, so that I could start touring under my own name. And a lot of times it’s really helpful if you’re supporting for a release that can get press. And so we asked if we could release it on our own. And they would not have allowed me to release an album on my own, but they were fine with me releasing an EP on my own, and later we gave them the digital rights to the EP as sort of a thank you for letting us to do that.

And that serves a couple of purposes. Once you release a record under distribution, once it recoups and it starts to make some money, you don’t see that money for a year and a half or so. And from the time when we started, we were able to make money from the EP immediately which was very helpful, because the transition from the band to solo was financially pretty rough. So that was a good thing. Pedro the Lion was drawing over 400 to shows and solo I draw 100 to 150, which I’m also completely happy with, but it was a big switch.

Popcorn Youth: Have you found that your fanbase carries over from Pedro the Lion days?

David Bazan: A lot of the older fans definitely carry over. But one interesting thing is that playing shows and opening for other people that have fans that for whatever reason were just not interested in Pedro the Lion, I’ve found that a lot of people that wouldn’t have liked Pedro the Lion, like the songs presented in a solo acoustic setting, which is funny to me. It’s actually kind of the opposite where I think of the solo acoustic thing as being a more generic, possibly less compelling version of the thing. I guess more people are prone to it because it’s more generic, just hearing the songs and not the style of the band, but some people have told me point blank, “Yea, I didn’t like Pedro the Lion, but I like this.” (Laughs) I think it’s pretty funny.

Popcorn Youth: As a songwriter, are you also interested in writing creative fiction or poetry?

David Bazan: Yes. As far as short stories and novels and stuff, I am constantly attempting to do that, but I’m just not that good at it yet. As far as poetry, I read poetry and I really enjoy it, but most of what I do ends up becoming lyrics. In that way I’m just not used to writing — I write melodies, and not just what is there nakedly on the page. I’ve written things that haven’t become lyrics, and I still go back and look at them in my journal. I guess that would be considered poetry, but I haven’t set out to necessarily to do that.

Popcorn Youth: Who are some of your favorite songwriters?

David Bazan: Well, with songs there’s different categories. The Beatles are ground zero for me, song-wise, even though lyrically, Paul is really gifted as a pop lyricist, but he doesn’t really say anything I am interested in. And John actually did, especially after The Beatles, and a lot of his lyrics developed a stronger social conscience, which I’m interested in. I’ve been interested in the band Fugazi for years, and it came out of a punk rock culture.

Also, growing up Christian, there was the impulse to preach, which is different than Fugazi’s music, but also figures in somehow. Unfortunately, it’s in there and I have to recognize it. I like The Beatles, and obviously, I like Bob Dylan a lot. Lyrically, I prefer Leonard Cohen slightly more to Bob Dylan, although he didn’t create as compelling of a sound as Bob Dylan, in my opinion. Jeff Tweedy, Thom Yorke, and Bill Callahan I like an awful lot. [Callahan] is probably my favorite lyricist right now.

Joanna Newsom records are kind of astounding, melody-wise. It’s really crazy. That song “Sadie,” especially. When my wife was pregnant with our daughter, we were preparing ourselves emotionally to be parents. I couldn’t even listen to that record “The Milk-Eyed Mender,” because I just would … it would cause me to not get anything done. Like, I would be driving, and I would have to pull over because I’d be crying. (Laughs) It’s such a heavy record for me.

Popcorn Youth: What you were doing before Pedro the Lion? Was there a relationship with your love of Fugazi to regional harcore or punk scenes that you were involved in?

David Bazan: Oh, absolutely it was. I was all about Fugazi and The Beatles. I heard The Beatles and started obsessing over them first, like in 8th grade. But then by 10th grade, I had started my obsession with Fugazi. I listened to them probably more than any other band in my life. But my songwriting voice and also my physical singing voice, they didn’t really lend itself to that sort of aggressive music. And so there was a tension there because what I was writing was sappy folk songs, but my favorite band was this relatively heavy post-punk or emo and or whatever it was.

They were a huge influence because at any given time they were my favorite band. But it was indirect, because I just couldn’t make my body do those things. And I guess physically, I’m reserved. Naturally I was hyper self-conscious as a teenager and not naturally a good dancer or anything like that. So my movements, if they were big in any way, like with expressing myself, it was always goofy. Which seems off topic but I always thought of Fugazi as being a very physically expressive band, in a way that I wasn’t comfortable being.

Popcorn Youth: Were you ever able to see Fugazi play live?

David Bazan: Oh yes, yes. You know, they were peerless. I mean there was no band like them; now, I’ve seen Radiohead play, and it’s a different kind of intensity, but it makes me feel the same kind of things. But what they were doing and the emotional intensity of it, I’ve just never seen anything like it.

Popcorn Youth: Was there a similar community of likeminded musicians when you were in Washington, around that area?

David Bazan: Yes. The reason why I think I started doing Pedro the Lion was because I was so inspired by my friend Damien Jurado. When he signed to Sub Pop, he made what seemed to be an endless amount of 4-track recordings which were demos. They then picked through and chose which songs would be on his album, which I still kind of hold against them. (Laughs) There were so many songs that they just passed over for whatever reason that were absolutely brilliant, but that was his fault as much as anybody else’s. They were so inspiring that I felt like I was part of a scene in that way, that I was surrounded by people that I was inspired by.

And then, once Pedro the Lion put out our first record in 1998, we immediately played our first show with Death Cab For Cuties and became fast friends with them. We played all kinds of show around town and were inspired by them and felt a camaraderie with them. We even toured with them over the years. Initially Pedro the Lion was bigger than they were, so we coheadlined tours with them. And then obviously they became the biggest band in the United States, and so they don’t open for Pedro anymore. (Laughs)

In fact, I’m going out with Ben Gibbard out in May. He’s doing a solo tour, so I’m going to go out and support him on that. But there has definitely been a scene, a group of musicians who are friends. I’ve known John Roderick for years, and his previous bands before The Long Winters, and I’ve been friends with him for a long time.

Popcorn Youth: In the 80s, the term “emo” was more associated with hardcore scenes in the 80s. What are your feelings about it becoming a word that was used to describe music like Death Cab for Cutie, for example? Where do you see yourself fitting into all of that?

David Bazan: Generally, it seemed like “emo” as a label came up again in a big way after Sunny Day Real Estate. And then there were a couple of Sunny Day Real Estate — well, not knock-off bands, but directly inspired — bands like Mineral that were part of the post-punk and hardcore scenes a little bit.

I enjoyed Sunny Day Real Estate, but there was also something sort of over the top about it that was a guilty pleasure. They hit on something there that was undeniable to me, personally. It was kind of complex, and a little less dramatic. But I didn’t see Death Cab or my own band as that at all. I guess it depended on what people were trying to do.

A lot of the time, during that period, people used the word “emo” or the word Christian in an attempt to be derogatory. In most cases I certainly was offended. Or not offended — I mean, I understood that what they said they meant to be derogatory, and so I took it as derogatory. But at that point, I didn’t listen to music that anybody would have identified as emo, so I didn’t identify myself personally as that. But I try not to take myself so seriously that if I were labeled as one thing, it wouldn’t get my goat.

Popcorn Youth: You mention your struggle with your Christianity and the public’s perception of you. What’s the most common misconception that people have about you?

David Bazan: It’s hard to say. Honestly, there’s many dynamics at work. The main one is that over the history of the band Pedro the Lion, is basically me, by all accounts, coming to un-faith from faith. So I was doing all of that internally, and in the albums sort of in front of people. And some people attempted more and more to categorize the band — and me personally — as Christian, which was a little frustrating because the process of losing one’s faith is somewhat taxing.

But then, as far as from a publicity standpoint, writers, as you know, are looking for stories. And a band that has a story is much easier to write about. And I’m imagining that we got a lot more press just beause we had that element. It’s not something that we sought. I actually kind of hated it, but at the same time I couldn’t deny that it could said in ceratin ways that could help with publicity, too. At the same time, there are plenty of examples of people who are at the record store, and they pick up a Pedro record and their buddy is like, “Dude, what the fuck are you doing? Those guys are Christian. You don’t want to tlisten to that!”

Popcorn Youth: On the other hand, it seems like lately musicians such as Sufjan Stevens and Danielson are very forthright about their faith, but the media and fans care a lot less.

David Bazan: I don’t know. I’ve developed a view of the media culture surrounding music as being fickle. It struck me because I don’t necessarily think it’s motivated by anything organic. Basically, Pitchfork fucked up, and didn’t know that Sufjan was a Christian when they gave his record a 9.0 or whatever. (Laughs) And the church didn’t really want to retract his adoration for him.

Popcorn Youth: That’s pretty cynical. (Laughs)

David Bazan: Yes … I know. (Laughs) But that’s not actually, maybe, my opinion. I think that Sufjan is a sincere and legitimate artist, and anytime that someone finds the level of success that he has found, that is just good for everybody. And that Danielson “Ships” record is awesome. And so for him to get the attention based on that, regardless of his belief system, it’s just awesome.

Popcorn Youth: And finally, how did you meet Zak Sally and enlist him to design the album art for your EP?

David Bazan: I met Al and Mimi [of Low] in ‘98, and they were on tour and just happened to know a person that I knew, and so I met them briefly. I was an enormous fan of their earlier records. In 2000, when “Winners” came out they heard a copy of it and liked it, and when they heard we were going to be in their area, they invited us to go and play a show with them in town in Deluth. From there, it just developed.

After that, they invited us to come out on tour with them, and we became friends. I think Zak [former Low bassist], of the three of them, was probably the most immediately warm of a person. Alan and Mimi are beautiful people, but it takes a little bit of time to break in with them. Over the course of time, all of us became friends, and when Zak quit, he was on a book tour and he stayed at my place and we talked about the possibility of doing something together. The EP was the next thing I was working on, so he suggested that he take a crack on the artwork.

It worked out great, because his recent breakup with Low definitely figured into his rather frank treatment of the themes in the artwork. That stuff was pretty much completely his idea. Definitely, when he first sent it to me, I was like, “Fuck, this is kind of brutal.” (Laughs) But I liked it too, I liked his analysis. And we talked about my situation frankly, too, as well as his situation with leaving Low, so I was happy that he was so comfortable being that way. In fact, he insisted that he portray me on the cover. I did not want to be on the cover in any way, and he said, “Tough, this is the way it is going to be.” He really took the reins with that one, and for that I am glad.