[Text by Bryan VanCampen; from the Ithaca Times] Constantinos Gavras, better known as Costa-Gavras, is a Greek born French filmmaker, best known for films with overt political themes, most famously the fast-paced thriller, Z (1969). His early films were made in French. Starting with Missing (1982), several were made in English, including two notorious collaborations with ham-fisted scenarist Joe Eszterhas, Betrayed (1988) and Music Box (1989).Z established Gavras’ reputation for inducing documentary technique into action and merging political issues to deliberately ambiguous effect. In the film, an investigating judge, played by Jean-Louis Trintignant, tries to uncover the truth about the murder of a prominent leftist politician, played by Yves Montand, while government officials and the military attempt to cover up their roles. 40 years later, Rialto Pictures has popped for new prints and a U.S. re-release; Cornell Cinema screens Z on July 17, 19 and 20.
Gavras took some time to talk to the Ithaca Times from Paris about the difficulties getting Z made, his friendship with director John Landis, and filmmakers he admires today as he continues making films.
IT: How do you feel about Z getting a 40th anniversary re-release?
Costa-Gavras: Oh, it’s something very strange, in a certain way, and very moving. I will say that I am proud of it, but I was very moved, because I never expected that this movie which was shown on television and DVD would be shown in theaters. So when [Rialto] proposed that from the United States, from New York, I said, “Yes, of course, but do you think it’s the right thing to do?” They say “Yes.”
IT: Why did you question if it was the right thing to do?
CG: There are so many movies out there that [a re-release] is a very special thing.
IT: Why did you make Z?
CG: Z was made as a kind of protest against the colonists in Greece. All Greeks out of Greece at that time, they tried to do something about it – riots and whatever, and signed petitions, and the only thing I could do is to make a movie. When I did the script, all the actors you saw accepted to play in it, but no producer or distributor would give a penny to make the movie.
I had a grant from the French government…and with that I was going around, and everybody refused except for the Algerians, who said, “Okay, you can do it here, but we don’t have any money to give to you. We give you all the facilities to shoot in the street, and some technicians.” Almost all of the major actors [and] myself [made the film] without being paid.
And we did the movie, and it was amazing, because during the shooting, we asked two journalists to come and see us and to write some articles. Nobody came. And that’s the story.
IT: What happened when it opened?
CG: When the movie came out, the first week it did very poorly, because a lot of people wrote about the political content of the movie, and people were a little scared about the political movies, you know. And little by little, the movie was playing for something like 45 weeks in Paris. It was a huge success in Paris and around the world, which was a big surprise also, because nobody was believing, was accepting, something like this. [Laughs] So that was the story of Z.
IT: What was the budget?
CG: Close to $400,000. [We shot] from ’68 through ’69.
IT: And no one wanted to make it? It’s political, but it’s also a great thriller with documentary elements as well.
CG: Everybody said there is no love story, there is no central character, the story of a Greek senator who is killed, who really cares about it? And so forth. There was nothing looking like a usual movie: there are so many people in the movie, there is no one character from the beginning to the end.
IT: If you were to see Z in passing on television, what do you see in it now in retrospect?
CG: When the police and the justice system can be manipulated, the whole system falls apart. That’s the theme of the movie. Today, we don’t easily accept a dictatorship. The justice has to be free, the police cannot be manipulated, and the army either. So that’s something permanent I believe with Z. They wouldn’t make that movie today. There are other films much stronger than this one.
IT: You have a new film, Eden à l’Ouest, out this year. Are you close to retiring?
CG: No, no, no, I keep making movies, I will make movies until the very end, as long as some people give me money to make a movie. [Laughs.] Because also this is important.
IT: Your friend John Landis says that making the movie is the easiest part of the process. Raising money is the hardest part.
CG: Absolutely. If I make, say, a thriller or a comedy or an adventure, yes, it’s easier to find money. Particularly these days, if it’s a comedy. But if I try to make a movie with more difficult subject matter, then it becomes difficult. Especially in Europe but it’s the same thing in the United States.
IT: Have you seen anything interesting lately?
CG: Oh! The very last movie I saw, I saw again Heat by Michael Mann, who was here at the French Cinemateque, and I saw also his very last movie, Public Enemies. They are interesting movies, both of them. And Heat remains a very important film in my feeling.
IT: I think it’s one of the great films about crime.
CG: Absolutely, absolutely. And especially when you see what comes out today from Hollywood, unfortunately, very few important movies are coming out.
IT: There’s this lovely picture of you in Giulia D’Agnolo Vallan’s book on John Landis, at sunset with Gillo Pontecorvo (The Battle of Algiers) –
CG: [Laughs] With Gillo, that’s right.
IT: Was that picture taken at John’s house?
CG: Yes, at John’s house in Beverly Hills.
IT: I think of Landis in terms of broad, American comedy, you were the last person I expected to see in that book.
CG: Yes, but you know, I like Landis because when I went to Los Angeles, I met him. [He] was the only person who knew so well the movies – European movies, American movies, American actors. Even secondary parts in movies, he knew the names. And it was so surprising to meet an American [so knowledgeable]. Instead at that time, my crew, with whom I was preparing Missing, when I would say we should see a movie, they would say “oh, it’s a movie by Universal or by Warner Bros., they never speak about the director. [Laughs] Or the actor. And John knew all of this.
I remember that time, I met also an important actor. I said “Have you seen The Seven Samurai?” He say “No, who did that movie?” I say “Kurosawa,” and he say, “Kurosawa, which nationality?” [Laughs]
IT: Isn’t that amazing?
CG: It was amazing. So John and I become friends, because we were talking about movies. And I learned so much about movies, American movies, through John.
IT: You supported him during the Twilight Zone court case and signed that letter defending him that was printed in Rolling Stone.
CG: Yes, I went there several times, absolutely, I was very curious to see the way an American trial was taking place, and I knew John has told me what the story is. [Actor Vic Morrow and two Vietnamese child extras were decapitated by a helicopter on the set of the Twilight Zone feature film.] The prosecutor was a kind of show woman, and she was coming there with a kind of extraordinary make-up, extraordinary clothing, and I said, “This is not justice, this is a circus!” Poor John and his wife [costume designer Deborah Nadoolman], who’s a great person also, they used to go there like you would go to a job every day, four days every day from nine o’clock in the morning to four or five o’clock in the afternoon, and going there for weeks, months, because…I don’t remember how long the trial was. It was pathetic to see that.
IT: For my age group, he was such an influence. Animal House seemed so radical to me, and it’s only now I see how traditional its structure is: underdogs strike back.
CG: Let me tell you, I showed it to my young children recently, and they were absolutely fascinated! [Laughs] It still works.
IT: Now I’ll have to see Spies Like Us (1985) again and look for you. [Costa-Gavras makes a cameo in Landis’ Cold War comedy alongside many other directors, including Sam Raimi, Terry Gilliam, Frank Oz, Ray Harryhausen, Joel Coen, Michael Apted, Larry Cohen and Martin Brest.] Why do you think Landis likes to put directors in his movies so often?
CG: I don’t know, he’s amazing. John is the director, and… [Laughs] It’s something he always did, and it’s amazing all the directors accepted, and I accepted. Probably for the same reasons, we all like John.
IT: Some directors find it disturbing to be on camera.
CG: No, I don’t like to be in front of the camera.
IT: Most directors don’t.
CG: No, no, the first time [on Spies Like Us], we went just to see him with my son who was very young at the time, up in Norway. And he said, “Oh, I put you in the movie.” [Laughs]
IT: And you said “What?”
CG: [Laughs] He said, “Yes, I put you in the movie.” It’s difficult to refuse to John sometimes.